A few short months into life at Aston Villa and Gerard Houllier has already hit upon a lethal combination at the club: bad results and bad image. Few would argue that the Frenchman has succeeded at the club but I’m quite happy to lay my cards on the table and say that there is reason to be optimistic.
There’s something refreshing in seeing Villa players who aren’t afraid of being in possession, an experience so alien to Villa supporters that most don’t appear to have noticed it. These are the same players who treated the ball like an unpinned hand grenade under their previous manager, and it points to an improvement in methods and strategy. Even more exciting, albeit partly forced upon him, is Houllier’s readiness to throw young players into the team.
But the main thrust of this post is not to argue that Houllier is doing well - he isn’t. He’s won just twice in the Premier League and the victories against Wolverhampton Wanderers and Blackpool were fortuitous, and his fixation on Liverpool - amplified in the last seven days by Monday’s fixture at Anfield and Villa’s limp performance within - is beginning to irritate even his greatest apologists.
And so a section of Villa supporters has decided that it’s time to start planning an anti-Houllier protest, presumably involving a torch-wielding stroll from the church on Trinity Road and the ritual burning of the French flag. Being French seems to be the greatest of Houllier’s crimes, and discussions about this prospective protest are littered with xenophobic abuse. It’s embarrassing and it suggests that no protest would be on the cards had Randy Lerner replaced Martin O’Neill with an Englishman.
I don’t think that’s the case. A protest would be in the pipeline regardless of the manager’s nationality because a large number of Premier League fans are unrealistic, misguided and a little bit thick. If they want Houllier out based on form, fine. There is clearly an argument for that and no Villa supporter in his right mind would not be frustrated at present. Whether they believe Houllier can or will turn it around is a valid point of debate.
But protesting would be unabashedly stupid. As Newcastle United fans sagely and correctly speak out against Mike Ashley’s insane decision to sack Chris Hughton and replace him with casino pal Alan Pardew, it seems a group of Villa supporters have taken it upon themselves to fill some kind of delusional void in top flight football. It doesn’t yet matter whether Houllier is failing because he’s (a) quickly improved upon a few of the problems easily identifiable under O’Neill and (b) been in the job for five minutes.
Talk of a protest results from the prevailing Results uber Alles attitude and the demand for immediate success, both of which have leaked from armchair supporters into the stadiums, where the idea of ‘support’ has become optional in the Premier League. The idea that a manager could be the target of a protest, regardless of whether there are positive aspects to his leadership (and there are, in this case), after just weeks in the post is bone-shudderingly cringeworthy.
It is also symptomatic of the modern fan in his ignorance of crucial factors that affect matters such as this. It takes time to turn around a bad position, and nobody can argue that O’Neill left Villa in a good place without drinking the Martin Kool-Aid. Losing key players and a lot of players at the same time is always going to be destructive, particularly to a team that’s undergoing significant change. And, most importantly, no football club exists in a vacuum. Yet if Villa stand still or dip in form and others improve, the manager must hang - apparently.
Setting aside the ridiculously short period of grace given to Houllier (zero days - well, he’s French innit), it’s interesting to note that many of his most vocal critics still appear to worship at the altar of his predecessor. O’Neill walked out on the club five days before a season that would have been difficult anyway, leaving it in disarray. And yet even now, after four years in the dugout and a dramatic stab in the back for the supporters who idolised him, he remains the subject of hero worship by the same people whose spitting, jingoistic hatred of Houllier has betrayed them as the worst kind of short-termist modern fan.
In his four years, O’Neill managed to alienate a large number of supporters with ill-informed and barbed criticism and systematic bitching to the press over very minor booing incidents, including one in which he appeared to interpret sarcastic applause at the long overdue substitution of fan favourite Gabriel Agbonlahor as booing of the player, conveniently changing the message from “It’s about time, you idiot” to undeserved lambasting of a “young” player. Classy.
He also had a habit of going on long winless runs, the very thing for which Houllier is finding himself aggressively disliked, the only difference being that O’Neill did so repeatedly with his own players because he was incapable of managing his side over the whole season due to his stubborn resistance to changing the team. He got away with it because he maintained a good league position in his time at the club (for which he must take credit) - but he should have done better. I believe that given the number of injuries this season and the improvement of other sides, O’Neill would have been doing just as poor a job this season as Houllier.
So, before you unfurl your half-baked banner on the Holte End, ask yourself a few questions. That Luke Young’s quite good, isn’t he? Would you prefer to see a centre back at right back? Remember Moscow? How great was it to see the kids teach Manchester United a lesson? Did any of them get a proper chance under O’Neill?
And finally, do you really want to be the new laughing stock of the Premier League? Hit the streets in protest at a manager who’s had less than half a season, no transfer window and more injuries to his squad than he can count on his fingers and that’s exactly what we - yes, WE - will be.
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Tags: Aston Villa, Gerard Houllier
Yes, it may be so. But when it all comes down to it, we simply just don’t like him.
Houllier out!
A very sensible written statement and I for one are in total agreement, MONs final thank you to all the support he received was to stick two almighty fingers up at us. GH has made a mistake with his comments and actions at Liverpool but will have been chastised by Lerner already . MON was critical of our support constantly over the time in charge and treated ud like fools in the Europa league.
GH has made dramtic changes already, without a first team squad available, I can see when the squad is fit and better technically players blended with youth who can adapt to the pass and move football we desire then you will see the results. This is a gradual change in philosophy and will take a while for the lump it up to Carew brigade a time to adjust, but this will change from youth to first team for the long term.
Why can they not see the whole picture? Pires was signed as emergency cover outside the transfer window, but also to teach the kids the Wenger methodoligy, McCallister and Cowens (legend who could keep and pass a ball) will continue this long after GH has gone, we will come through this and once we have a bit more experience in the team results will come, we were better than Sunderland and Fulham, played well against Manure, there are signs, 60% at Liverpool and a better squad with more options up front I think we would be nearer the Spurs than where we are now. I expect the run to come to an end at VP against the baggies and then its only a short time before the window. Please start judgeing from Feb, but not until
Keep the faith, look at the big picture, UTV
more uninformed rubbish… the talk of any potential protest is more about his lack of respect towards the club on monday than anything else… the majority of fans know that we are trying to play better football… the majority of fans know that we have a ridiculous amount of injuries all season… the majority of fans know that we have had a tough pre-season with o’neill cowardly walking away 5 days before the season started so our season would be ruined and his moron mates in the press would then state that we should have backed him more financially, and at the same time, criticise the likes of portsmouth and leeds, etc… villa fans on the whole are not stupid… but when someone behaves the way houllier did on monday, then fans have every right to be unhappy… if he was in any other job and had been so unprofessional in a “probation period”, he would have been out on his ear… however, since his half baked apology, you probably havent noticed, because it doesnt suit your agenda, that a lot of fans have cooled down their talk of a potential protest.. some may still go ahead with it, because they dont feel that his “its your fault for not understanding the deep lying humour behind my comments” where he stated that he didnt mind losing 3-0 because he liked the club, not to mention his other actions, apology is good enough… which is their perogative… they pay good money to go and travel and watch that debacle on monday, so they are entitled to make their voices heard when the so called manager of aston villa acts with so much disrespect towards aston villa football club… and just because skysportsnews and the sun havent told you we are a good football club, doesnt mean that we just have to accept everything that happens.. especially when idiots like the author of the pathetic article above continue the myth that we dont deserve anything other than just to be grateful to exist…
And to think you used to like me.
If we’re talking about disrespect, look no further than Martin O’Neill, who mugged off the Villa support for ages while they bent over and took it.
Nice to hear from you after all this time, Andy.
When will you bunch of muppets get over yourselves. Aston Villa is a business owned by someone who has the right to make his own decisions because he’s put his money where his mouth is. exercise your right to stay away from the ground and let the rest of us go the games and support the team. GH has made mistakes but ultimately SO WHAT. The football has improved, and with experienced players returning, plus a freshening up in january results will improve too. The team will progress under GH. The team under the previous manager had peaked because he was unwilling to change the team or the tactics. Give the guy some time, get behind the team of eff off and moan somewhere else.
Agree with every word but the biggest issue by far in my opinion is the problem of the defence, for which I have seen various reasons put forth - the style of play, the defensive midfield players, physical fitness, individual form, tactics etc. The fact remains that it is a complete shambles, leaks goals with even the slightest pressure from the opposition (Birmingham, Liverpool opening 20 minutes …), is a recipe for relegation and has cost us games we should have got something from and, in my view, Houllier’s position is inextricably linked with getting that right. In a sense that is ridiculous but if he cannot get it right, poor results are inevitable and his position will become increasingly tenuous and probably rightly so. I hope he can sort it and take us forward with a bit of long overdue style which there are signs of but in the modern game, results are everything.
@spineynorman - Results are everything and always will be everything, but since when did managers get such a short amount of time to get them? The demand for immediate success is ridiculous and is tinged in this case by the fact that he’s annoyed the fans - again, something for which O’Neill was allowed to escape criticism on a regular basis.
Agree with you about the defence, it’s appalling. As I said in the post, Houllier is not doing a good job in terms of results OR image at the moment. I just can’t believe that fans are willing to write him off so quickly and it sickens me that the word protest has been even uttered.
i have no idea who you are chris nee… indeed, martin o’neill showed extreme disrespect to the villa, and i eluded to as much in my post… but again, as it doesnt suit the agenda, it is ignored… not sure how we “bent over and took it”, as we were slate when we made our feelings known, by both the manager and the media… mick dennis even compared us to the millwall and west ham thugs who stabbed each other when rioting… but in this case, are we actually letting our feelings known that we are not happy? or should we “bend over an take it?” because i am confused, as if we keep quiet, we are “bending over and taking it”, and if we dont, we are embarrassing… cant win it would seem… but then again, that is what happens when there is an agenda…
What’s my agenda exactly?
O’Neill was in his post for years before any dissatisfaction was expressed and is STILL revered by a large number of fans. Houllier has had weeks.
just to add, i am certainly not a fan of martin o’neill and his constant mistakes, stubborn blinkered attitude and stone age tactics (not being a fan of o’neill is something else media outlets have criticised villa fans for)… i am not in the camp of wanting houllier sacked… i will not be there with a placard and banner calling for his head… however, i do understand some villa fans irritation and disgust at his disrespect towards the club he is currently manging, in difficult times i might add… i like what he is trying to do with the team, but unfortunately, the previous manager left us with hoof merchants that fitted well for half a season under his charge, but for anyone trying to bring us into the modern era, will always struggle with… and the injuries were always going to happen as players bodys got used to proper training, rather than the mid morning stroll under o’neill… o’neill has a lot to answer for, and i am fully aware of that… however, houllier needs to get it into his head that he is not the manager of liverpool anymore… we dont want to hear every interview him babbling on with doe eyes like grandpa out of the simpsons about his time at liverpool… we dont want the manager of aston villa, touching another clubs crest while he is supposed to be in charge of our club… we dont want him fornicating over the opposition fans and anthem while completely ignoring the loyal villa fans who have paid their money and travelled miles to watch utter garbage in freezing conditions… we dont want him to tell everyone that the game is over at 2-0… and we certainly dont want him telling everyone that he doesnt mind losing 3-0 to the opposition becuase he “likes them”… whether thats in jest or not, you do not say that, especially right after the game when emtions are raw… that is the crux of the matter…
you are the only person who knows fully what your agenda is chris… however, your comments are merely a continuation of anti aston villa nonsense that the media seem to continue to excrete… maybe you just want a job writing for ‘the sun’? who knows but yourself…
Chris, I agree and watching Villa this season has been a mixture of frustration (at not beating Spurs away or Man U at home for example) tempered by the long awaited (by me anyway) emergence of the likes of Bannan, Hogg, Clark, Albrighton which I am happy to accept will result in inconsistencies and I have the patience to accept that. What really gets me depressed though is the fact that you feel as though you could put a pub team up against our defence and you wouldn’t be totally confident even then of a clean sheet and these are experienced international players we are talking about not the youngsters. Houllier simply must sort that - that is his job. I believe he is hampered by the fact that he is not a spin doctor like some I could mention and comes across as an genuine honest open guy who sometimes could do with engaging his political brain before letting his mouth go. Nice guys being good managers is not necessarily an impossible dream and I do believe he could make us into a genuinely exciting successful side with time. Sadly in the internet age, time appears to be measured in milliseconds not months and, unfortunately vocal minorities can make a lot more noise than was the case when e.g. Ron Saunders was allowed to make unpoular decisions to build something.
Proactivity is the key. Let’s put out this fire, before it gets out of control. Houllier out!
The Liverpool defence under GH was the base that allowed the rest of the team to express its attacking potential. Given time, the same will hopefully come to Villa. Houllier has put Luke Young at right back in place of Carlos. It gives us a bit more going forward, but i think we are weaker defensively as a result, particularly from set pieces. Collins and Dunne are all over the place. i can remember watching us last season feeling pretty relaxed when crosses were coming into our box. I now expect us to concede every time the ball gets in our penalty area. Warnock is also a problem at the moment. I am finding it hard to blame this on GH though. We conceded a hatful at Newcastle before he took charge. We got hit for 7 at Chelsea last season. Carlos in the centre may help, but I don’t know if this is enough. The defence needs to find form and confidence from somewhere.
I’m personally still excited at the thought of what may be to come if the manager is given the time to stamp his methods and choice of players on the club. I just don’t get the Houllier Out brigade. i notice it doesn’t come with an answer to our problems, as if they will all diappear along with him if he did go. Does anyone really believe that. If so i bet you’re all really excited about Santa coming as well
Never have I agreed so vehemently with a post regarding Aston Villa. For four years I’ve been telling fellow fans that O’Neill should have done better. 6th 3 years in a row and a cup final is an achievement, don’t get me wrong, but it could have been so much more, we threw away champions league qualification the year before last, it was there for the taking and in my opinion the overwhelming factor responsible for us not getting was O’Neill.
His refusal to move away from the rigid and frankly outdated 4-4-2 formation, his insistence on playing players out of position, injured and out of form alongside his tentative approach to substitutions (and even when he made them they weren’t very well thought out, if we needed a goal - more strikers, if we needed to keep it tight - more defenders) was at best infuriating.
I’m sorry, but O’Neill’s transfer record was not far short of atrocious. Beye, Sidwell, Shorey, Heskey, Warnock suddenly became a bad player when he signed, Davies, Guzan (we courted this guy for months), Dunne (last season was a complete fluke, we are now seeing the real Richard Dunne), his failure to sign Luke Young from Charlton for £2.4m when it was possibly the most obvious transfer in history and then forking out £6m for him when he was a year older. Zat Knight (who weren’t actually that bad), Harewood, Salifou. And don’t get me started on how much we’re paying this rabble. Add this to the players he’s let go, what I wouldn’t do for a Craig Gardner in the middle of the park and Gary Cahill at the heart of our defence atm.
Is it any wonder Randy began to question him? Picture the scene, we have a collection of ageing, overpaid, un-sellable footballers currently on our books (half of which O’Neill doesn’t even play) and O’Neill comes in with a list of transfer targets including Robbie Keane (30+, out of form, insanely expensive) and Scott Parker (30, injury prone, insanely expensive). I bet he couldn’t get his hat on.
Agreed Houllier hasn’t had the best of starts, but look at what he’s had to deal with, discontent from Ireland A.Young and John Carew, a host of injuries, defenders who have forgotten how to defend and a goalkeeper who hit 40 this season and look bereft of agility and confidence, add to this supporters unwarranted discontent and an executive board member on fan forums and you have a recipe for disaster. Could anyone else really do any better? O’Neill himself would have struggled this season with this squad, and he assembled it!!
O’Neill saw this coming, it’s why he left.
Andy, if Chris has an agenda, he hides it well. He’s one of the biggest, most knowledgable Villa fans I’ve met over the years. But then I suppose I would say that.
I, however, have no loyalty to Villa, or any other Premier League team, and think Villa would be barking to get rid of Houllier. At the very least, he needs to strengthen in January.
From Premier League to Conference, history and trends show that any club that indulges in multiple sackings often ends in relegation. Or financial disaster. Or both.
If you sack Houllier, I can see Villa seriously fighting relegation. If you don’t. Well, it may be a struggle (albeit a cheaper one), but this was always going to be a season of transition for the club.
That said, there is one excellent, capable young manager available out there, and that’s Chris Houghton.
Even so, I’d stick with Houllier if I were you. His commitment to youth will bear dividends in the long term.
We’re getting this with Chelsea as well. Suddenly, everything is Ancelotti’s fault, from Abramovich’s negligence in the transfer market, to the firing of Ray Wilkins, to Frank Lampard being injured. The problem is our paper thin squad, not a coach who has won the European Cup and led us to the double last year.
gary, dont get me wrong, as i have said, i dont want to be sacking managers every few months… i am more than patient and more than understanding of our situation than most… i have written off the season due to o’neills pre season actions, and that was before the injuries… i am delighted that the youngsters are getting game time, especially the likes of delfouneso, clark, albrighton and bannon… not too impressed with hogg, but then again, i never thought he was good enough in the reserves either, and i dont think he would be used if it wasnt for the injuries… and behind that, we have gary gardner and fabian delph to come in too once they are fit… and below that, jordan graham and jack grealish, and a whole host of other young talent coming through… ben petty for example, is doing great things with 7-11 year olds, and that for me, is where it all starts… so exciting times ahead in that respect and we will see serious fruit from the academy over the next 5-10 years and beyond… however, the disagreement i have with chris’s comments are that they contradict what is written before, and are overly negative towards villa fans… i am actually surprised that he is a villa fan actually, although maybe the anti o’neill comments should have given that away… there were generally two major camps regarding o’neill… overly for, or overly against… and those in the middle like myself, who saw the middle ground… o’neill got criticism… he got lots of it, and the majority of it was justified… when that happened though, the media jumped all over us and proclaimed that we didnt deserve a manager of o’neills calibre… chris himself is criticising villa fans for having the audacity to let houllier know we didnt like his actions on monday night, and then in the next comment, saying that we “bent over and took it” because he doesnt think negative comments were made towards o’neill… which simply wasnt the case… the timing of the negative comments, are down to houllier… it is his actions so close to being named manager that is being criticised… if o’neill had done something so stupid, so quickly, we would have made our feelings known then too… he also comments about the giving him more time, and then comments about it being “fine” wanting him out based on form, and then goes on a rant about the reasoning… it isnt “fine” to want him out based on form, for the very reasons, amongst others, that chris himself has stated… it isnt some xenophobic over reaction, purely because we think we have a god given right to be the worlds best… its purely down to the fact that we love our club and dont like to see people being disrespectful… and houllier showed extreme disrespect to the whole club on monday night, and that is why people are making noises…
If Brian Little ever came back to Villa as a manager (I know, it’s hardly within the realms of reality) but we would expect him to show us some respect, and there would inevitably be a love-in. That isn’t a good enough reason to suggest Little should no longer be a manager at that club. To protest against Houllier because he showed some kind of affection to club he clearly has some emotional attatchment to (the fans there, irrespective of stereotypes about Liverpool fans, were amazing supportive around the time of his illness) shows a really narrow-minded and short term view. Is Houllier doing a fantastic job? No, course he isn’t, look at the table. But he took over a squad that had lost a manager on the dawn of a new season, he’s got them playing football, not looking afraid to keep the ball, and blooding in youngsters.
This season was ALWAYS going to be a write-off once O’Neil left, and the work that Houllier is doing this season will pay off in the long term.
I firmly believe that GH has to go ASAP, before sats game at baggies ideally.
The last thing we need is GH in charge during the transfer window, he is killing our club now, a poor transfer window could send us down.
big players like ashley young and carew will go in january for sure followed by others.
Lerner made 2 big mistakes in the summer - mon being allowed to leave, employing GH. lets hope that he does the right thing now and admits GH is the wrong man for villa.
Killing our club? Have a word with yourself. Football’s supposed to be fun, enjoyable, a game. Aston Villa is not ‘dying’, and if it did it wouldn’t be because a manager made a poor start after taking over from a backstabbing pr*ck who had a bewildering amount of support despite his appalling behaviour.
To address some of your points:
Why is GH being in charge during the transfer window the last thing we need? He hasn’t had a transfer window, so how can you possibly make this leap? Isn’t it a chance for Houllier to make some changes to the team. Nobody’s saying he’s done a good job but how on earth can we judge him so soon? He’s had a large number of injuries to contend with and he was thrown in at the deep end by his predecessor.
Ashley Young and John Carew…yes, Ash will probably leave. That’s modern football: if you don’t get results, your best players will most likely hit the bricks. I find it laughable that you cite Carew as a “big” player. The guy’s contributed next to sod all this season and we’d barely notice he was gone. Sad but true.
As for O’Neill leaving somehow implicating Lerner, that’s a pretty clear misunderstanding of the situation in my opinion. Whatever reason O’Neill decided to go - and my personal view is that he chucked his toys out of the pram over perfectly reasonable decisions and requests by his boss - the blame can ONLY be laid at O’Neill’s door. To leave five days before the beginning of a new season was downright insulting and I find it surprising that any Villa supporter can forgive him for that. I certainly won’t, but then I’d grown to dislike the stubborn, offensive, over-rated guy anyway. He would have done no better than Houllier, I’m certain of that. We were heading this way anyway.
Did he make a mistake appointing Houllier? Quite possibly, maybe even probably. But to judge after a few weeks and to talk about a protest makes us look like the worst kind of knobends.
it was not only insulting, it was downright vindictive and selfish… a move to ruin our season and protect his own reputation via his media mates, who could then claim he was “over achieving” with little old aston villa, and cry that villa fans have “unrealistic expectatons”… which is nonsense… he bought players to fit his dinosaur tactics, and for his favourites, that was fine until they became knackered while other expensive players sat on the sidelines to be ignored (some man management!)… however, to claim that we would have gone the same way under o’neill, as we are under houllier, is nonsense… the injuries wouldnt have happened for a start, as they are due to the improvement in training having an effect on theplayers bodys, and the tactics that work while the players are fit, would have got us results to get us further up the table… but on the flip side, crap like cuellar would have played right back and been skinned over and over, the players would have been knackered after january yet continue to play, we would have had an end of season slump in the new year and the football would have been crap… you have to look at things from both sides chris, otherwise your anti martin o’neill thoughts cloud your judgement…
thats not to say that houllier is a rubbish manager… his record proves that isnt the case, however, he does need to know that he is now the manager of aston villa, and we dont want to hear about his liverpool times… he needs to realise what a big job being manager of aston villa is, and if he still wants to continue reminiscing about his time at liverpool, then maybe its best doing that on his front porch with a chilled glass of wine in front of his grandchildren… i am very much looking forward to january and seeing who he brings in, and while my expectations are tempered with the fact that january isnt the best time to purchase, with players coming back fit, and a couple of players being brought in to fit the improved football philosophy, its the first january in a few years i am looking forward to… i also expect the team to improve in the final months of the season, in an ironic sort of role reversal… the big test will come next summer though…
tbh, i wouldnt be overly concerned if ashley young left… since being labelled “world class” (ha!), it has all gone to his head and all he does now is try to beat as many men as possible, fall over and whinge at the referee a lot… he is enfuriating, and i think we miss albrighton more than we would young…
oh, and apologies for some of the language yesterday… i stand by the sentiment, however, some of the language used was uncalled for, and for that i apologise…
All in a day’s work, Andy. Think nothing of it.
Interesting article Chris. I agree a protest at this stage would be risible, but when you listen to GH you have to ask whether he has the fire any more to turn things round.
You say Villa would have done just as badly with O’Neill in charge - we’ll have to agree to disagree on that. At least we were organised. I too wanted Luke Young at right back - but look how he’s playing!
The defence is an embarrassing shambles (what does Collins have to do to get dropped), the midfield powder puff and the attack toothless. I don’t see those areas being resolved by the return to fitness of journeymen like Petrov, Reo Coker and Heskey. At present we look like a relegation team - definitely a relegation candidate - and unfortunately I’m old enough to have seen it all before!
I’m not starstruck by O’Neill - it was probably time for him to go and some of the football was painful - but you can’t argue with 3 consecutive 6th placed finishes.
…but apart from that negativity, I’m very pleased by the emergence of Albrighton - who would have come through anyway under O’Neill - Ciaran Clark and especially Barry Bannan, who would have left the club if O’Neill had stayed.
They would all have featured if Kevin MacDonald had been given the job of course.